Microsoft sued for 360 update issues

  • By Polybren, GameSpot
  • Posted Dec 8, 2006 5:36 am AEST

Source: A post on the Xbox.com forums, regurgitated with skepticism (but not fact-checking) by Team Xbox, Computer and Video Games, and Joystiq. What we heard: When Microsoft released the Fall Update for the Xbox 360 on October 31, reports that it was "bricking" some systems--rendering them unable...

Source: A post on the Xbox.com forums, regurgitated with skepticism (but not fact-checking) by Team Xbox, Computer and Video Games, and Joystiq.

What we heard: When Microsoft released the Fall Update for the Xbox 360 on October 31, reports that it was "bricking" some systems--rendering them unable to play games or even boot up properly--quickly flared up online. Web sites specializing in the Xbox modding scene speculated that the bricked systems were an intentional byproduct of the update. According to them, Microsoft wanted to break consoles that had been tampered with to do things for which it wasn't intended, like play pirated copies of games. Microsoft required that anyone wishing to take their Xbox 360 console onto the Xbox Live service download the update.

While initially quiet on the subject, Microsoft the next day acknowledged problems that affected "less than 1 percent" of Xbox 360 owners who installed the update onto their consoles. The company said it was working with those affected to resolve the issue, and released an updated version of the Fall Update.

That apparently didn't satisfy everyone, as earlier this week, a poster on the official Xbox.com message boards waded into the middle of a 60+-page thread about the Fall Update problems and claimed that he had filed a class-action lawsuit against Microsoft in the matter.

A handful of gaming Web sites picked up on the news and passed it along, each of them noting that it was an unconfirmed report from a message board poster.

As it turns out, the poster was telling the truth. GameSpot obtained a copy of the original complaint, which was filed in a Washington district court. The suit accuses Microsoft of breach of contract, negligence, and violation of the state of Washington's Consumer Protection Act (CPA). Stating that the affected consumers number in "at least the thousands," the suit contends that Microsoft is refusing to repair or replace the broken systems unless the users pay "up to $140" to ship it back to the company.

The plaintiff is demanding that Microsoft pay at least $5 million in damages for breach of contract to those affected by the Fall Update problems, and an additional amount of at least $5 million in damages for an unfair or deceptive act under the CPA. Should Microsoft argue that it had no agreement to breach with the affected users, then the plaintiff contends Microsoft was negligent, and should be made to pay at least $5 million in damages.

[UPDATE] The official story: A Microsoft representative issued the following response to the matter:

"A small percentage of consoles (less than 1 percent) were affected by the Fall Update. An updated version of the Fall Update was made available on Xbox Live on November 1 which eliminated issues relating to new or refurbished consoles malfunctioning after applying the Fall Update.

"Users affected by the initial Fall Update would have seen an error message and should call Xbox Support (1-800-4-MY-XBOX in the US and Canada). Microsoft is making every effort to resolve this issue for its customers as fast and easy as possible. It's also important to note that Xbox Support is paying for the shipping and repair/replacement of all Xbox 360 consoles that malfunctioned as a result of the Fall Update on October 31, before it could be fixed on November 1. They just need to phone Xbox Support and give them the proper error message indicating it was the Fall Update that affected their console."

Bogus or not bogus?: Fortunately for those reporting without a net, not bogus.

640 Comments

  • UNDERDOG_DAN

    Posted Apr 12, 2007 11:06 pm PT

    this was in 05 when they had the problems or 06

    i got mine in may of 06 it works fine

    but if you lay a 360 flat down it heats up way faster and can possibly mess up for bieng over heated and the hardwair/chips are at the bottom so when you lay it flat it could possibly fry the chips getting to over heated i stand mine up i also have a pellican (brand) fan stand wich helps keep it cool _________
    [_______0__] laying 360 down the heat goes towards the hardwair/chips __ | | | | | 0 | |__| standing it up the heat goes to the bottom wair theres hardly any hardwair/chips

  • AceCometh

    Posted Jan 7, 2007 8:46 am PT

    Even once the console is bought, they still own it as an intellectual property. The warrenty is voided if modding is done. Read your owner's manuals, everyone. It'll keep you from seeming to be uninformed and money hungry.

  • AzureCuzYeah

    Posted Jan 2, 2007 3:49 am PT

    Its nice to see that someone in the community can stand up and defend usfor faulty products. The only thing I am worried about is the reprecusions we might have for microsoft maybe having to dish out 5 mill. Then again Microsoft is so loaded it might have no effect.

  • _Sam_

    Posted Dec 20, 2006 2:18 pm PT

    I think that microsoft should pay the cost to fix it, so it's working fine for everyone. They shouldn't have to pay any more than that IMO

  • flashtek

    Posted Dec 20, 2006 8:02 am PT

    It sounds like people have been "modding" their XBOX's and now they don't work. Well stop try to do things with the equipment that it is not made for you morons. Why do you think companies put non-disclaimers in their warranty information? A perfect example is Intel if you overclock it and burn out the cpu tough. Same with the XBOX. I hope these goofs realize that when you file a suit against a company like Microsoft it only makes things worse for all of us. Now for those who got a bricked system after the update should be compensated for time and trouble but this should be done on a case-by-case issue and not a broad-spectrum suit.

  • tjwalker57

    Posted Dec 11, 2006 7:49 pm PT

    mines been down since 11-30-06,immediately after the update,i got a invalid profile message,i've been unable to recover my gamertag since then,5 calls to tech support,all saying they'll call you back,they are working on it.
    i still get a message when i try to recover my gamertag---xbox live unavailable,try again later

    maddog walker
    22873

  • GhostStalkerX1

    Posted Dec 11, 2006 5:53 pm PT

    Heh gman has a good point.

  • gman1974

    Posted Dec 11, 2006 1:56 pm PT

    This is by no means a bash or fan-boy comment, so please read the entire comment before you try to call me as a Sony fan-boy. I do not have a modded 360 and it was bricked due to the fall update and I was told I had to pay the $140 dollars to have it fixed, but was later told it would be fixed at no charge ( thank you, since it wasn't my fault). What happened later was what really pissed me off though, I was told they would ship me an empty shipping box to return my my newfound "doorstop", this would take 5 business days. I then have to box it up and send it to M$ so they can repair it this I was told will take 4-5 WEEKS!!!!!! Are you kidding me? I pay for my Live Acct. one year in advance and when it is all said and done I miss out on 2 mos of service, not to mention I spent $200 on the HD-DVD drive that I can't use. It gets better though, in the course of the return my system was lost, and now I have to wait 10 business days so that I can find out when they will be sending me a new 360. The bottom line is this M$ is responsible for this problem, and I don't buy that it is only causing problems in one percent of 360s out there. $5,000,000 is nothing in a class action lawsuit. If on a low side 50,000 consoles were effected that is only $100 dollars per person. I think that is due compensation for a person that is forced to go through the 3 mos of BS put on them after they willingly shelled out $400.00 for a system "Bricked" after getting an update that wasn't properly tested prior to release. This is the kind of stuff that happens when huge companies decide to make the consumer the "guinea pig" and they should be held accountable.

  • capthunt

    Posted Dec 11, 2006 1:51 pm PT

    "less than 1 percent"
    Isnt that the same thing they said about Xbox360s not working properly when it was first released and it acutally turned out to be quite a few. Microsoft and ur devious,evil lies tisk tisk tisk

  • Dernagon

    Posted Dec 11, 2006 12:45 pm PT

    To those confused:

    I agree that $5 million seems like a lot. However, this isn't one guy suing Microsoft by himself. It is a class action lawsuit meaning that anyone who has also had the same issue can be part of it and receive their share of the settlement.

    If MS says that 1% were affected then figure out the numbers. I have no idea how many 360s have been sold so far but let's assume that its 5 million. That means as many as 50,000 people have useless 360s because of the update. If only the minimum $5 million were awarded, then assuming everyone affected is part of the lawsuit, they'd all get $100 each. If both settlements were awarded for a total of $10 million, then everyone gets $200.

    In reality assuming worst case scenario its a pretty reasonable sum to ask for. If the jury were to find MS guilty then a judge wouldn't necessarily give what the suit is asking for. He'd dish out a number which compensates everyone reasonably. Most likely.

  • ello432

    Posted Dec 11, 2006 11:41 am PT

    mirosoft has a reputation for the bad updates widows is the best example. but modders add extra hardware to the systems, that the update was not ment for the extra hardware so it's modders fault not microsofts and if you voided your warrenty tuff luck you knew better. 10 mill is just some made up number that they though was a good amout for a lawsuit . the 10mill c'mon they are providing you with a pass time that use chose you use no one is forcing you to use it no forced you to buy it they a doing you a service and instead of letting them fix it your sueing them what a joke. they were trying to make your gaming experence better with the update not destroy the modded systems. this is damaging to the hole idustry and no better then what Jack Tomson dose

  • thor107

    Posted Dec 11, 2006 11:36 am PT

    My xbox 360 works great... Oh.. wait I don't have one All you rich bastards can kiss my a$$ and I'm sure most of you don't even appreciate that wonderful piece of hardware.

  • VolcanoMan001

    Posted Dec 11, 2006 11:32 am PT

    What in gods name are you talking about?

  • Kfoss

    Posted Dec 11, 2006 10:11 am PT

    LOL thats the way to do it microsoft..."fany press release" LOL ummm yea the fact you dont have the software on disk makes it troubblesome dosent it..in that for once you shall be forced to make updates that dont kill peoples stuff...HAHAHAHA what goes around comes around..LOL

  • adamskihart

    Posted Dec 11, 2006 10:08 am PT

    lol asif peeps who illegally modded their xbox and completely voided their warranty are complaining about an update screwing their systems up!

    if you think this is bad i cant wait to see what sony has up their sleeve to stop the modders / pirate gamers. Sony is the worst for anti-piracy / copy protection so I cant wait to c what they have put in the ps3..

  • bunnyb0t

    Posted Dec 11, 2006 9:48 am PT

    BurntToast - I had a launch 360 too, which also was ticking along fine until microsoft released yet another update, and then it bricked it. Oh well, almost made it unscathed.

  • Katsumoto18

    Posted Dec 11, 2006 9:22 am PT

    So the fall update affected people with a modded Xbox 360? or everyone in general? In 2007 M$ is supposed to fix the 360 heating issues by making the processor chips smaller? I also think 5 million is crazy..but I suppose going against microsoft you'll need that amount!

  • kill_switch_eng

    Posted Dec 11, 2006 9:19 am PT

    what does bricking the console mean? sirry its probabley a stupid question

  • jordanbijl

    Posted Dec 11, 2006 9:18 am PT

    I havn't had a problem with my 360 (of owning one for what.. a week) But... if people are having these serious issues... why doesn't microcrap just recall all 360's to repair them so they in fact DONT DIE!!!

    If my 360 dies I hope I can lay a lawsuit on microsoft...

  • Mobius007

    Posted Dec 11, 2006 6:47 am PT

    OH SNAP!! Microsoft gets OWND by customer..

  • Blazer88

    Posted Dec 11, 2006 5:45 am PT

    Frivolous, MS should win.

  • thextreme1

    Posted Dec 11, 2006 3:51 am PT

    1%? Hahahaha. Just like only 6% of launch consoles were bad.

  • SinisterOhana

    Posted Dec 11, 2006 1:07 am PT

    Ok This is my situation, I got my 360 in March of the this year and since then to now my 360 was kicking strong and was playing strong till That Fall Update, I noticed my system was freezing up on certain games like Superman Returns Rainbow Six Vegas and Smackdown VS Raw 2007, I dont mod and im a legit player I purchase my games from a retailer so Microsoft is to blame. Yea they want 140 to repair their screw up but now the people have to pay for Shipping and Handling which is a load of BS, Just out of the blue Microsoft has changed policies of not sending Prepaid Postage boxes to Gamers so Microsoft with is the d*mn problem I can't even get my system to boot because the system reads those 3 red lights and the hidden test i performed that Diagnosis' is an Unknown error which someone thought it was an Overheating issue which is incorrect because i have the intercooler 360 so what the f*** gives!

    MS get yo Sh*t straight!

  • zermeno

    Posted Dec 10, 2006 11:51 pm PT

    Lucky you. I bought my original 360 back in Jan '06 and as soon as i got the POS it gave me problems(error 72). I'am on my 3rd console and while I love the games on it . I 'am just waiting for it to just break-down again.

  • PbrghSteelers86

    Posted Dec 10, 2006 11:01 pm PT

    My 360 works great. Never had a problem before. I got mine on November 22nd, 2005. Does that day ring a bell?

  • elgoyo

    Posted Dec 10, 2006 9:18 pm PT

    My 360 broke with the fall update I bought it on january I called microsoft and got a new one for free, ofcourse I had mental damage due too that i had gears of wars and call of duty 3 in mine hands and the only thing I could do was smell the box and memorize the back of the box

  • Da_B34R

    Posted Dec 10, 2006 9:15 pm PT

    this update bricked my 360 like a month ago and i never modded it either, heck i have no idea how to mod a system. im just an average gamer that got unlucky that day microsoft was nice about it though and fixed it for free since i was under warranty, but i had to pay $30 for shipping to mcallen, tx. and got it back like a week later.
    anyway, could i possibly get my $30 back from ms because it was their update that killed my 360? thanks

  • GhostStalkerX1

    Posted Dec 10, 2006 9:06 pm PT

    Heh my self i would sue them. I also hate the feedback system i couldnt tell you how many times i was banned from XBL do to bogus feedback and ppl be a$$'s. I mean cmon just because you lose to someone superior to you dont mean you leave them CHEATING FEED BACK NUBS.

  • ace_rns

    Posted Dec 10, 2006 7:50 pm PT

    HAHA, people who mod thier xboxs are being removed from xbox live.. .so deserving,... want a modded xbox, no more modders, no more cheaters, lifes great.

  • thekey

    Posted Dec 10, 2006 7:24 pm PT

    I have a launch console and I never had a problem. Still don't have a problem.

  • GrimBee

    Posted Dec 10, 2006 4:45 pm PT

    This is totally stupid... $10 million in damages?! What for?! Microsoft replace the console for stuff like this. Personally, my friends' 360 heated up so much (he did have a monitor covering the top of it..) that it went off.

    He complained to Microsoft, and they sent him a new 360. Simple as.

    Whoever this updated affected, all they need to do is phone Microsoft to get a new one. Sueing them is just STUPID! I mean, thats totally baseless!
    Why would they need to sue M$ for that much? To pay court fee's? The person chose to go to court, and not just accept a new console...

    $10 million is a stupid amount. For it to go through, they will need to have EVERY person who's 360 bust with the update give their testemony to the court, which had to be proof-read by the person themselves.
    Then each testimony would have to be examined for any hints towards any "modding" or anything like that.
    If there is a large hint to this, then the case is void.. Microsoft would be in the clear... if the court says to M$ that they have to pay the damages, replace all consoles... then its nothing at all to M$ as $10 million is probably 0.1 cents to M$.. lol.

    If I was a person who was affected by this, I would simply demand a new console. Not go all Jack Johnson on M$ and ask for $10 million!!

    Once again, this probably is a Sony rep creating a negative stir for M$. Stupid stupid stupid sue... thing.

  • testlabmonkey

    Posted Dec 10, 2006 4:16 pm PT

    Oh and i think youll find that MS have NEVER admited that the update was designed to brick machines... that was modders speculation only....

  • testlabmonkey

    Posted Dec 10, 2006 4:13 pm PT

    I like how people complain about how bad the xbox360 is "with its overheating problems" and the live update that killed like a whole 1,000 machines or so. Easy for people to stand up and say well my PS3 hasnt got any of these problems.... hey i remember when peoples PS2's were overheating and lasers wearing out all over the place.... things break and updates can never be made 100% perfect (unfortunately). people who are put out should be compensated with replacement hardware for sure but thats life and these companies are out to make the most money as possible... thats business

  • Angryduck67

    Posted Dec 10, 2006 3:48 pm PT

    I'm all about sticking it to the man, but this guy is gonna get squashed under Microsoft's lawyers, and will only end up with a huge bill for the legal fees.

  • alexnavarro

    Posted Dec 10, 2006 2:53 pm PT

    Personally ,I admire the way some people mod their 360 and make them unique and, sometimes a little better. But just face the thuth : Consoles are not meant to be modded. If you are willing to risk your console and give a shaith about the warranty then do it. But do not expect that MS repair your console if something damages it , even if the damage is caused by an official security update from MS. For the unlucky ones that did not modded their console do not worry, MS will repair or change your consoles for free. It is a fair a and reasonable way to satisfy their customers.When you buy a console you are making a commitment with the company to play on the console you bought only the games that are licensed(not illegal copies) to run in that console format , and any use and attach only their licensed peripherals to it. Still want to mod? You can mod a PC the way you want it with no legal problems with games, software or OS developers. I am always amazed by the way americans want to sue anybody for the most inane of the things. Some gamers need a reality check.

  • SonyPSP

    Posted Dec 10, 2006 2:13 pm PT

    It is because of SCUM ike this guy[Derek Ramirez] why m$ have to BRICK innocent users computers...

    http://www.nj.com/news/ledger/essex/index.ssf?/base/news-3/1165642579168390.xml&coll=1


    Saturday, December 09, 2006

    Operating out of a Newark home cluttered with DVD burners, computer towers and piles of blank discs, Derek Ramirez was like countless other high-tech thieves pirating computer game software, authorities say.

    But, those authorities say, Ramirez was a thief with a difference. He would not only sell customers pirated DVDs for Microsoft's Xbox 360 game. For $60, he would modify an Xbox console so it would not reject counterfeit software and be able to play online with xbox users, they said.

    I HOPE he gets locked up for a LOOOOONG time. Modders are making innocent people (bricked consoles tnx to m$'s overkill bug-filled anti mod update) suffer and pay $200 to get their unmodded bricked 360's repaird.

  • LordFalcon07

    Posted Dec 10, 2006 2:09 pm PT

    "My console standing vertical (which supposedly bricks consoles)"

    Who said that?? Something else happens. Try turning the 360 from vertical to horizontal or vice-versa with a game playing.

  • HyperMetaDragon

    Posted Dec 10, 2006 1:02 pm PT

    I don't get it, I've done everything possible to kill my 360 and it nevers dies...that includes 9-hour long Call of Duty or GRAW sessions, leaving it on all day, etc.

  • pk

    Posted Dec 10, 2006 10:59 am PT

    5 Million?! gtfo greedy ****

  • 8004jr

    Posted Dec 10, 2006 10:50 am PT

    What do these updates do for the console? I just got my 360 two days ago and updated it, but the only difference I saw was the added 1080p. I was also wondering why my 360 only has 10.3 GB. It should have been about 14 GB right?

  • Riverwolf007

    Posted Dec 10, 2006 10:13 am PT

    Typical. Most likely this guy has a 300gig hard drive installed with every game he ever rented from blockbuster downloaded on it.

  • jigga1142

    Posted Dec 10, 2006 9:53 am PT

    Welcome to the american legal system; it's like having a thief break into your house, trips down the stairway, get arrested but sues you and wins.. That was the intention of the last update, to stop people from modding the 360. I've installed it on mine, nothing happened.. I've ran my 360 ALL NIGHT SEVERAL TIMES, it didn't over-heat, it didn't freeze and ran fine..

  • rdeachin33

    Posted Dec 10, 2006 8:35 am PT

    My 360 crashed from the update. They replaced it for free but it also took them a month to do it!

  • durial117

    Posted Dec 10, 2006 6:52 am PT

    Thats stupid... ive had my Xbox 360 since last January and it hasnt screwed up at all. Well exept for the time my friend took it for a ride on my skateboard. He actually put my Xbox 360 on my skateboard and when the skateboard hit a bump in the floor my Xbox 360 hit the ditch... rolled about 4 times across the floor. The only thing that was messed up was the disk tray but I just fixed that myself.
    Just so you know kids, skateboards + an Xbox 360 = more money for Bill Gates so ya try not to let your Xbox 360 run off with your skateboard.

    Meh I could care less. I dont have Xbox Live and I dont download the stupid updates so im fine the way it is.

  • durial117

    Posted Dec 10, 2006 6:50 am PT

    Thats stupid... ive had my Xbox 360 since last January and it hasnt screwed up at all. Well exept for the time my friend took it for a ride on my skateboard. He actually put my Xbox 360 on my skateboard and when the skateboard hit a bump in the floor my Xbox 360 hit the ditch... rolled about 4 times across the floor. The only thing that was messed up was the disk tray but I just fixed that myself.
    Just so you know kids, skateboards + an Xbox 360 = more money for Bill Gates so ya try not to let your Xbox 360 run off with your skateboard.

    Meh I could care less. I dont have Xbox Live and I dont download the stupid updates so im fine the way it is.

  • Mr_Saturn26

    Posted Dec 10, 2006 6:12 am PT

    well apparently sony been really caustious of thier console to be sued, seems to me that thier are tired of being sued anyway, which would explain it.

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