Australian game retailers speak out on grey imports

 @FlamingFury I don't like disc switching but I'd still rather have a physical copy of something, seems more I dunno real when I can pick up a case or disc.

 @davedrastic

 I can understand your rationale now that I know what you've been through. Obviously ordering one thing and recieving a different (however slight the difference) is an annoyance and probably illegal in most senses.

Our experiences are obviously different which is why we have different viewpoints, in terms of games I wouldn't have a huge problem as long as I was getting the same game that does the same thing. You want the region 4 game that you paid for, understandable.

Perhaps if you've you've had these problems in a number of circumstances you should have made a complaint to the ACCC or relevant body to ensure that this doesn't happen to you again.

 @kingzacaus I've been into EB Games, bought games, and then discovered that they're not Region 4 games, they had simply been stickered to appear as such, so to hear that EB are now correctly marking their products is very much a good  thing, and may I say, a new thing. Let's hope this practice continues and the other bricks and mortar and online retailers follow suit.

Perhaps we ought to ask why they're putting imported stickers on their imported products? My guess is that they've suddenly realised that they ought to be doing the right thing and not marking items as something they are not, and that deceiving customers is both illegal and not prone to good customer relations. I can't think of another reason myself.

"Who cares it's a cover. Are you really going to get top dollar for a resale game anyway?"

Resale value is somewhat irrelevant. Not totally irrelevant as Region 2 games do have a market value lower than Region 4 games, but it is somewhat irrelevant as it does not follow that all games bought will be sold.

I would think we all care about our covers as much as any non consumable product we purchase. If your happy to buy a CD of Abbas Greatest Hits at full cost but without the album art then we're simply a part of different generations. The generation I belong to expects to receive what they pay for and expects to receive new items in perfect condition.

"Games are often opened as well, major department stores, KMart, BigW, Harvey Norman etc often open the games to put discs and books behind the counter, you could have the same argument over opening the seal on these games as well.""

Agreed. The same issue occurs within these shops in regards to opening up the items and to a lesser degree with stickers.

When they open up the item how can any of us be sure that the DLC codes haven't gone missing? We can't be.

I also very much dislike the stickers these companies put on the items. If they put the stickers on the sealed product then there is no issue. If they put the stickers on the plastic game box then frequently an ugly glue residue will be left (dependent on the quality of the sticker), which thus turns a shiny new product into an ugly one virtually instantly, which is a shame for those that pride their collection. If they do what I was complaining about, which is to put the stickers on the actual paper manual or cover then they're basically defacing the item as to remove the stickers will inevitably lead to damage.

I can tell you that i've bought games from 2 major retailers in the last month, I've bought the games from their online stores in which they had an image and description of the Region 4 game, and I've received the Region 2 game. That is unfair and illegal. If you order an advertised product, the supplier is obliged to supply that product. Not something very similar to that product, not something that works the same as that product, but the actual product that was ordered.

Now if these retailers had clearly marked, online and at the point of ordering, that the games were imported then there would be no argument. But that is not what they have done.

From what you've said, it seems that some of the retailers are realising their faults and finally doing something about it.

I'm not disputing that it is not their duty to cover up the classification stickers, I've not said that at all. My point is that it is their duty to ensure consumers aren't misled into believing a product is one thing, when it is another, as in the case of a bricks and mortar store placing stickers over the classification symbol and not otherwise indicating that the item is not the Australian version, or as in the case of online stores it is their duty to clearly advertise the item as an imported product or to actually send out the Australian item.

Now if I wanted a Region 2 item I can go to many online stores to buy them at a much lower cost than the major retailers will sell them for. But my preference is to have the Region 4 item. So if I buy a game that has been advertised as a Region 4 game from a major retailer at a cost of $30, and receive a Region 2 game with no apology or explanation, that I could have purchased elsewhere for $20 should I be happy with a Region 2 game, then I have every right to feel deceived by the retailer. Being able to purchase a game cheaper elsewhere or not is technically irrelevant. The retailers should send out the advertised item under all circumstances. But i've mentioned the above to illustrate the issue.

Your experiences are clearly different to mine. I've bought games from EB in store that have not been marked as imported games. This practice of marking them is a new practice, I can assure you.

Further, I have, several times, ordered games from the major retailers that have been shown to be the Region 4 games on the online images, and then received Region 2 games.

Further, when addressing the retailers in all occassions i've been faced with "the item is exactly the same, there is no region locking, there's no problem, we're not going to do anything about it". Which IS an extremely slack attitude and it disapoints me greatly that these national retailers are able to continue to break the laws by selling items that are different to those that are ordered.

Perhaps this analogy may help. If I order a Mambo T-Shirt and receive a Billabong T-shirt, do I want to be told by the retailer that they're both t-shirts  and do the same thing and that there's no problem. They're either the same thing or they're not. If there are differences, then they are different. It doesn't matter how different, it's a matter of whether or not they are different. And despite the retailers, and many gamers, assertations to contrary a Region 2 games IS different to a Region 4 game. Indisputably.

 @davedrastic

 Last time I was in EB Games (and probably the only time I had been there for a long time) I noticed some import games. They had a sticker saying they were imported and the rating sticker either stuck on the cover over the UK rating or on the plastic over the UK rating.I dont know what your argument is about really, I've bought a number of games from places where a barcode or other sticker has been placed on the booklet. There are often stickers on covers too, promotional items, price tags etc. Who cares it's a cover. Are you really going to get top dollar for a resale game anyway? Games are often opened as well, major department stores, KMart, BigW, Harvey Norman etc often open the games to put discs and books behind the counter, you could have the same argument over opening the seal on these games as well.The games are marked as imports, if you want something that isn't then pick up the more expensive copy next to it. Come to think of it I think that last time I was in JBHiFi I noticed an import sticker on a game as well.For your question"If they advertise Region 4 games, send them to us. If they cover up Region 2 games with Region 4 games, can they not do that on the actual cover itself, and can they make it clear to us that we're not buying a Region 4 game."Like I said from what I've seen they haven't made attempts to cover up where the game is from, they've simply done their duty to cover the UK rating with the AU rating, typically on the plastic but yes on some occassions on the cover.If you want to get an Australian Copy, with no stickers and go into the store or order online I almost guarantee you would get Australian stock. If for some reason you got an import I would understand your anger but from what Ive seen they are clearly marked.

 @kingzacaus What they're doing with these stickers is representing a Region 2 item as a Region 4 item. That is deceptive.

Also, if they put the sticker on the cover itself then they are defacing the item - whiteout or not. If you attempt to remove the sticker from the paper for sure you'll rip the cover.

When people buy a game, they are not just buying the ability to play the game. They are buying the whole item. Much like with a CD.

If you go to Sanity and they sell you a copy of Abbas greatest hits but they don't give you the album art, are you just going to accept that? Probably not, because you will be keeping this item amongst your collection for several years and you want to receive the item in pristine condition, unless you are paying a discounted rate that you understand to be discounted because there is no cover art.

What the retailers are doing, online and brick and mortar, is advertising the Australian Region 4 games then sending out Region 2 games - and to add insult to injury, they're unsealing the games (which means we're not to know whether or not the item is new, and wether or not the DLC codes have been used), and then putting stickers  that can't be removed on our property.

The whole practice is absurd, deceptive, destructive and unjustified.

If they advertise Region 4 games, send them to us. If they cover up Region 2 games with Region 4 games, can they not do that on the actual cover itself, and can they make it clear to us that we're not buying a Region 4 game.

Gees is it too much to ask that they provide us with what we pay for.

 @davedrasticThey're just sticking AU classification stickers over the UK, they're not going through with whiteout eliminating all mentions of the region it was intended for