i think this game will be my fav for a while i love the upgrade tree and units gain veterency cant frickin wait
Supreme Commander 2 Impressions
By
Kevin VanOrd, Senior Editor
Chris Taylor talks art, economy, and technology during an E3 2009 demo of Supreme Commander 2.
If you played Supreme Commander, the excellent PC game, then you know that Chris Taylor and Gas Powered Games can make a great real-time strategy game. You also know just how ambitious and massive they can be. Supreme Commander was a complex and satisfying game, and it looks like its sequel is going to be just as massive but will address a number of problems with the original. Better art design, a better economy, and improved pathfinding are just some of the improvements that we can look forward to. We got to sit down with Gas Powered Games' Chris Taylor for a demo at E3 2009, and he filled us in on the details. Want to know more? Read on!
Taylor mentioned at the beginning of the demo that he wanted to explore story and characters more in Supreme Commander 2, but that he also wanted to continue to focus on technology just as much as before. He then showed us our first glimpse of the game, an overhead view of a map called "Illuminate 5." If you've played the same developer's Demigod, you'd be familiar with the art style of the backgrounds. It featured a giant arena hovering over an illuminated city, and its color palate and 3D-on-2D look were highly reminiscent of the aforementioned game. This isn't the only aspect of Supreme Commander 2 that takes its cues from Demigod. The same graphics engine is being used, which makes Supreme Commander look more natural--and run smoother. Expect the game to run on a variety of systems, and to run better than its predecessor. Of course, Demigod is also known for its multiplayer connection issues. Taylor acknowledged the problems, adding that Gas Powered Games has learned a lot from the experience. The developers have yet to settle on a multiplayer technology partner.
Expect Supreme Commander's level of strategic zoom to return in Supreme Commander 2. If you recall, the original allowed for unprecedented zoom levels, letting you pull the camera directly into the action, as well as out to an expansive overhead view that reduced the units to small geometric icons. We didn't get to see the most distant zoom levels in the demo, but Taylor suggested that the process of zooming in and out will feel a lot more natural, and that the transition between fully rendered units and icons will be smoother and more sophisticated. The stronger art style should also make it easier to identify units at a distance.
Speaking of that art style, expect to see fewer generic units across the board. The Aeon faction has evolved into a new faction: The Illuminate. We saw their units in action, and they look more organic than their prior counterparts. All three factions--the new, as well as the returning Cybrans and the UEF--possess more-detailed units, with a stronger overall appearance. We watched as UEF tanks were attacked by Cybran gunships, with lasers flashing everywhere, and though this battle would generally have tipped in favor of the gunships, you'll now be able to use a unit cannon to fling units from the other side of the map and get them right into the action. This lets you bring the proper counters into the battle much more quickly and leads to more flexibility than before.
Actually, flexibility is the name of the game in Supreme Commander 2. In the original, early units were rendered almost totally obsolete as you gained tech levels. Now, tech upgrades affect existing units, and new tech trees will let you outfit units with things such as additional (or longer) barrels, antiaircraft weaponry, and more. These skill trees are another of Demigod's features that inspired Supreme Commander 2, according to Taylor. You will also be in charge of the all-important ACU unit, just as before. Its upgrades also allow for a more flexible approach. For example, you can add artillery to the ACU's shoulders, grant it torpedoes, perform a "core dump" ability should you fall under nuclear attack, or even pop off its head if you need to quickly escape from battle (the benefits of such a move remain unclear). Of course, there are all-new units as well. For example, though experimental units return, there are also mini-experimentals, such as an Illuminate unit that Taylor affectionately referred to as an Ear Canal. These snail-like units look as if they would have been at home in Star Wars: Episode One, and were cool to watch as they moved across the map. We also saw a standard experimental unit called a Cybran-zilla, which looked appropriately draconic. There will also be naval units, but we weren't able to see them in action in the demo.
The economy has been tweaked as well. Energy and mass are still your two resources. However, now you will be able to purchase a unit or upgrade only if you can afford it, rather than queue it up as you could in the original. This means that players are less apt early on to paint themselves into a corner that they can't escape from later. Additionally, you will be able to earn experience by attacking other units. This experience can be used to research upgrades (though so can other resources). This means that if you prefer to turtle up, you will still have access to upgrades, though players who want to get into the action immediately will still be able to tech up as well. Pathfinding has also been improved. According to Taylor, when you have hundreds or thousands of units in play at one time, it's more difficult for a PC's processor to keep up with the pathfinding needs of the game. Newer software technology and multicore processors will now lead to better pathfinding, wherein units will adjust their path even before reaching the object in their way, much as you would notice someone walking directly toward you and move to the side, rather than waiting until you are directly in front of him or her.
What we saw of Supreme Commander 2 looked great. The stronger art style serves the game well; the bland, austere environments of the original have given way to a more interesting, artistic feel. We saw impressive details everywhere, from the smooth animations of mass extractors to excellent lighting and shadows. And of course, the battles were huge, raging across enormous vistas just as big as those in the original. Taylor wants the game to run--and run well--on three-year-old hardware (the first game brought even some then-modern systems to their knees). Sadly, we didn't get to see any nukes, though Taylor assured us that nuclear warfare is back and will remain the most powerful attack in the game.
Taylor also talked briefly about the "neural net," an evolving database that lets the AI adjust for actions that you make during battle. For example, if the enemy spams gunships and you keep taking them down, it will use what it learns from the net to adjust its strategies. Clearly, Gas Powered Games aims to make Supreme Commander 2 just as big as the original while streamlining its complexities in ways that make sense for both veterans and newcomers. We'll have to wait and see if Gas Powered Games can succeed: Supreme Commander 2 is due for release for the PC sometime in 2010. There will also be an Xbox 360 version, developed concurrently within the same studio, though we learned no additional details about that version. We'll bring you more on this hotly anticipated strategy game as details become available.
By
Kevin VanOrd, Senior Editor
Kevin VanOrd is a lifelong RPG lover and violin player. When he isn't busy building PCs and composing symphonies, he watches American Dad reruns with his fat cat, Ollie.
85 comments
I really like how the new units look, how they move, and all the detail. but why, oh why, did they have to go and ruin what i hoped to be the new standard economy. supcom's economy system was great and i dont get how people could think it would be confusing. you have your production and your consumption. you want more production than consumption, but you have a buffer. how hard is that? if they had just added a bunch of units, made it lighter on my computer, some new pathfinding, whatever, i would have bought it without a second thought. but with the economy changed, i will have to think long and hard about it. and now experimentals will be even more expensive, first you cant buy anything until you save up for them, then you have to wait the eternity-and-a-half for them to build. also, tkchun, if you want a game where you can teleport into your enemy's base check out achron(achrongame.com). but then again, they can go back in time and move their units to surround the ones you teleport in before they get there.
Renewed economy? Whats wrong with the old one? But then, ya, you're pretty much dead after your enemy destroys your base & economy back in the first game. Anyway, hope it would be too different, like typical RTS where you have to save up to build your army. Besides that, a unit cannon also sounds kinda funny. Being so technologically advanced, one would expect you to be able to send units straight into your enemy's base through teleportation like in DoW. But then, I wouldn't want to be on the receiving end, its really annoying having your enemy pop up in your base, messing things up. So, maybe its not too bad, I can at least see them coming, & maybe shoot them with SAMs. Hopefully. Anyway, definitely a must buy, seldom do you ever come upon an RTS this awesome. Way to go GPG!
With square enix now part of the effort this will be intresting, it all sounds perfect if you read their news blog about this game on their website. Does anyone if Chris Taylor is the same guy who writes for Atomic magazine.
why in the world would they change the economy? the economy of SC1 was one of the best aspects!! If this means they have removed the queve/repeat system that means adding a boatload of micro managing! Dont do that!!!!
This purchase system is f**king awful. I mean toning the economy down abit is fine but screw those guys who cant manage an easy economy. No other game did this kind of building/economy so well and now he trashes it.. And why so many Tier4? It just encourages more long boring games. I say take most of the Tier4 and implement their abilities into the tier1-3. Those boring tier1/2 units need an overhaul.
i only hope that this one isn't has heavy on my PC has Supreme Commander 1 otherwise i can't play it. I had to get the game under the minimum just to play SC1 and it would still choke sometimes.
yah I liked superem commander 1 it was bad ass I like game play, so did me and my friends it game we still play with beers and cigar sit back and we play the game superem commander two I was looking at maybe new gfxs engine, more units and better AI - with better hardware resrouce managment, so it play better on more machine that are not supermachines. maybe random map generator would been nice so that game would randomly creat maps.
I agree with Rouse02, that was a good selling point. I think I'll have to wait and see with all of the changes that they are making to it. to me, the 1st SupCom was just fine. what I want out of supcom 2 was new units.
I'm with mabbb, teleporter makes MUCH more sense than a "unit cannon". Also, only thing that annoys me is the change to the economy, I absolutely loved how you had to build on an income/expenditure rate in SupCom, why change that to the "done-to-death, in-every-rts-imaginable" buy-and-build system? Gonna really make those looping production queues a tad tricky, nevermind the lengthy building templates. Definately keeping my eye on this, and if they change the economy back to the SupCom method it's a guaranteed buy for me (Yeah, it's a bog deal for me :P), if not, maybe I'll hold out for a review...
Sounds good, the only thing that I can see a irritant is the new queue system. The best part of the old SupCom was the ability to queue up any amount of units and then go about your business. I fell this new way will hender the the speed at which the game will be played and might end up being micromanagement heck. But, either way, I will buy it without hesitance.
Supreme Commander :/ sily game from my vesion do i play a real war Stratagy game or ants and insects war ? they need to stop it and make and new game with good camera :o
Well I just can?t wait, I loved the last two S/C games and I?m really looking forward to this new one .Lets hope E/A don?t try to buy them out !
Ok srsly, the UNIT CANNON...bit corny...how about UNIT TELEPORTER......thats cooler, like wat mabbb said. Experience.......? That doesnt sound very appealing but meh. Last bad sounding thing is the fact you have to be able to afford the Unit to queue it up or something, that makes building mass armies very annoying cause you would have to have enough resources to be building up defence as well as being able to run the upkeep of building a large army. Last thing, if you can upgrade units to have aniair, doesnt that take some of the balance out of the game? i mean having a tank being able to kill a gunship as well as a ground unit is a BIT annoying, youd need a stronger than usual unit to take it on. Keeping nukes is agiven, u cant take the power of completely annihalting someone away from us:) overall, there is noway ill let this slip through my grip.... no hesitation to buy.
Will look forward to this . Unit cannon sounds dumb though . Why not have a unit teleporter instead . Hope it has some stealthier anti radar units .Bridging the gap between tech 3 and experimentals is a good way to go .Also giving the level 1 units upgradability is also a very good idea .
the first was awesome, i think this one will be awesome aswell, bcos the've adressed my biggest issue with the first, unique units
What's the point in the unit cannon? If your stupid enough not to support your forces then make sure you have some transports ready. Just sounds gimmicky to me, I hope they scrap it before release
WNxRebelion what u mean man empire didnt suck... yeh took them long enough but thats cause they mostly waited for ppl to get more powerful hardware but yeh they shudda dont better... still its not a letdown most of the bugs r fixed and there r only few in the game and counting the mods, next patches and multiplayer feature (better not screw up!) will be better. Anyway supreme commander rules... next one better not suck :D
Will SC2 have a multi-player save game option? The original lacked this feature, which was very disappointing considering that you could generate "epic" game maps that would take hours and hours, if not days, to complete.
Lol ok I will agree on one thing, the RTS releases this year all sucked, period. Empire Total War, concept fantastic, creative assembly did a poor launch and have patched the game more than they have any of thier other games and in a much shorter time period. Making an arguement that DoW2 was good on the other hand, give me a break. DoW2 is a modded and simplified CoH, they just coned you into paying 50 bucks for it. A 10 year old could grasp the concepts of that game because there is no territory control, there is no way or PURPOSE to defend ANYTHING, they hand you all the units practicalyl in the start of the match with very little work or thought towards what you should get instead of that like you did in CoH. DoW2 one of the best RTSs of the year...HA, i'd rather buy it's expansion Tales of Valor, at least its supporting a game that forces you to think about doing things before you go through with it. Which is why im beginning to get dissapointed with Supcom2 with thier economy change, but whatever...no different then the MMO world, let's simplify everything to please the casual gamer.
Everything here sounds great except the bit about experience. I really don't think experience should be a part of most RTSs. It's okay for the unique ones, but now everyone is using it in some form or another, and I just don't think it fits. You don't need things like experience or capture points to promote aggressive play. As long as harassment is smart but not overpowered, (or if you look at it from the other side: as long as turtling is risky but rewarding) GOOD players will try to stop each other from turtling, or take advantage of a turtling opponent by expanding like crazy. Developers shouldn't cave in to the habits of bad players, bad players should cave in to themselves and learn to play.
They said it will run on many platforms. Supreme Commander didn't need much to run. If you had a multi-core processor, you were fine. That game is heavy on CPU, not so much on GPU.
@ S0crates: GPG has already given us a taste of "transforming" units. The Cybran have that ship that deploys legs as it approaches the shoreline. But it would be sweet if GPG could enable the player to give ships wings.
there are some subtle things that i don't like about this game... it's mostly flooded with retro design 'problems'. (i know where this game comes from nontheless, before you acusse me): -why do they have to use so much Pink in the backgrounds and scenario tint? combined with pale blues, reds and browns? it looks horrible to watch -the war also sounds mostly like "chiw-chiw-chiw" and "piw-piw-piw"... like so arcade-era and 80's sound resembling. Should lower the pitch of some sounds or make them beefier. -and i get the feeling too that the unit designs are still very retro in a negative way, like 'rectangle over rectangle plus a stick for the cannon' with some carvings added for detail, all very hard-polygons looking, you know... i'd like SupCom to be updated a TAD BIT to current times, but whithout losing it's spirit. I'd hate to see a SupCom anywhere close to C&C anyway. in the end i think GPG needs to renew their artistic staff somewhat for some new air. Hope you understand my message.
I am dubious about the "unit cannon" as well. I am surprised that SC2 does not seem to be taking advantage of an obvious opportunity: its resemblance to Transformers. How hard (and yet how cool) would it be to throw in a few transforming units? I would like to see fewer units in play at any given time, but more cool unit building options! And...what happened to the Seraphim?? Don't tell me they are going to be in an expansion called "Fragile Alliance 2"...
I can't wait! I loved Total Annhilation and Supreme Commander, and this seems to be shaping up quite nicely as well!
This is a breath of fresh air after being let down by the RTS releases earlier this year, only Empire Total War and Dawn of War 2 were good releases,others were half-baked . Hope they put in a story this time,not like Demigod.
I hope they make another super bad-ass video like they did for the first one. The one on Fields of Isis where the UEF and Cybran were duking it out and it ends with a nuke going off. I watched that video like it was a porno. Can't wait!
See, news like this just makes me a proud PC gamer owner. So sick of PS3 this and Xbox that. Oh Im sure the PC experience will be much superior from that of the xbox unless something like DRM cripples it.
Great news. The first SubCom was fantastic (although you needed a pretty beefed-up system if you wanted to run all high-settings smoothly), and lived up to the legendary Total Annihilation games. By reading the articles posted so far, the sequel looks very promising, along with Starcraft 2. Always up for another RTS, and can't wait to try this one out!
SupCom 1 was a disappointment to me due to its drop in frame rate when more than about 300 units were on the field of battle (despite my PC more than meeting the recommended requirements). I hope that they make this issue a priority fix in SupCom 2. I also hope they improve the way units can be targeted.
Sounds cool. Stardock got owned though. The Demigod issues probably mean GPG won't be coming back to Stardock anytime soon.
Is there going to be a counter for hectagons? All I could do was go mass triangles and hope for the best. Maybe they can make some stronger trapezoidz...
looks amazing! Only issue though.. Am I the only one who actually really liked the economic system in supcom 1?
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Game Info
- Release Date: Apr 1, 2010 (AU)
- Release Date: Mar 4, 2010 (AU)
- Classification Board: M
- Release Date: Sep 15, 2010 (US)
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