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5Jan 13

This is in response to people's knee jerk reactions that the upcoming Tomb Raider game will feature multiplayer.

http://www.gamespot.com/news/tomb-raider-gets-multiplayer-6401949

I'm hearing people complain to the point where they simply have lost all interest in the game now. Why? What about MP made a game you were so looking forward to so undesirable now? Does a game that has an online feature, which doesn't cost you a single cent more to purchase the game, that you will never use really bother you to the point where you won't play the game anymore? Why is that?

Have you ever had a toy you really loved as a kid? A G.I. Joe or a Barbie or a Hot Wheels or a Cabbage Patch Doll, something you loved so much that it never left your side? Then your little sibling got a hold of it and started playing with it and now you want nothing to do with it? That's kinda what this is like. Other gamers who love multiplayer will now be able to play "your" Tomb Raider. "But...but... it was MY Tomb Raider!"

It could also be the fact that we somehow believe that the time and resources spent into making the MP take away from the single player. It could be the reason why we've been seeing a lot of 5-6 hour action games lately. We think "multiplayer" and see "desperate attempt to appeal to more gamers". Even if that is true, can you blame them for wanting to make more money? It's a very harsh industry out there. Lots of studios have been closing their doors lately. If they get a few more bucks from tacking on MP modes, then let them do it. Just don't automatically think the single player suffered as a result. We've been following Tomb Raider closely for years, and MP just now got announced for it. Do you really think that such a high profile title is going to suffer because of MP? It's entirely possible that there was a new budget drawn up solely for the MP. That happens all the time. Two different teams, one making the story mode, one making the online portion.

But regardless of whether or not MP takes away from the SP, people's outcries boil down to this: a rift in gamers. There are the elitist self-entitled snobbish gamers (or hardcore) that don't want the other crowd (the casuals) touching their precious games. They feel that as soon as the casuals generate interest for a "hardcore" title, it becomes devalued. They feel "alienated" because the company tried to market to people who aren't happy with just single player games. But we need to let that go, and I say this because I used to be one of those gamers who thought games were only for me. Gaming is for everyone, not just you. Gaming is becoming more and more social. You will see more and more multiplayer. You CAN'T let that deter you from a game you WANTED to play. "But I don't want to play it anymore." That's a lousy excuse. You need to retrain your frame of mind and approach Tomb Raider or whatever game you wanted like you never knew MP existed in the game.

And it's not just with multiplayer. Another example of people losing interest in a game for no good reason is Bayonetta 2. Oh, the ridiculous reactions from people, cursing and making death threats towards Nintendo when had it not been for them, Bayonetta 2 would be vaporware. People are so quick to forget that fact. "But I don't want Bayonetta 2 anymore. It's on a kiddie console." Seriously, it's you that's sounding like the kiddie.

I feel that we as gamers invest too much of ourselves in our hobbies. We place ownership on things that aren't really ours and we spend too much time wrapped up in gaming politics, which makes us more attached than we should be. We lose focus on the real reason why video games are even made in the first place. They're made so that we can have fun, but not we as in "we", but we as in "everyone". It just strikes me so odd that a simple "Multiplayer" that flashes on a video game title screen is enough to not make a person not play the game at all.

If we really can't have fun with our hobby anymore because other people are having fun with it too, then maybe it's time we find another hobby. Or, we could just shrug our shoulders and get a Clorox Wipe and clean off our toys and go back to playing G.I. Joe and Barbie...

166 comments
kohle36
kohle36

As for the snobbish elitism of gamers, I'm not convinced it's as common as you seem to think. Sure, there's always a vocal minority on the boards every time something like this comes up. But for a lot of people, a publisher's / developer's insistence on modifying a product for wider appeal signals a fundamental shift in design strategy and priorities. It shows a willingness to modify or discard other aspects of the game (which may be part of the reason current fans play at all), in order to lure other sorts of fans (which may or may not be interested anyway). 

We have to understand that the gaming world isn't just divided into 'hardcore' and 'casual' as so many seem to think. Within either of those categories, there's a lot of diversity and variation in what we actually find enjoyable to play. Personally, I don't like first person games. It's not just the hyper-militarized power fantasies or shooting of all the foreigners (though certainly, that's why I don't play CoD/Battlefield), I actually find the perspective and motion unnatural and a little bit nauseating. I'll make the odd concession for a truly stellar game, but I'd rather 3rd person it up all day. 

That's a small example, and there are many others. Point is, there are certain design choices in games that are popular, yet some gamers find unsavory. It's not elitism, it's a desire to continue to enjoy the franchises that you do in your little niche of gaming space, irrespective of whatever else is selling 11 million copies. And it's frustrating for many fans of an established series to see a pub/dev go this route, because those 11 million are already so catered to, while a gamer who doesn't necessarily enjoy what they do is left with a handful of titles per year. It's why people freaked out when From said Dark Souls II was going to be 'more accessible'. It's not elitism in the sense of  'I won't enjoy this game if you can' (at least not for me, and I suspect not for many others), it's a desire to see continuity with the design choices in the series that made people fans of the game in the first place - design choices that might have frustrated or alienated some other players.

Now, does multiplayer necessarily affect the design choices of single player? I'd argue (as below) that yes, it can.

kohle36
kohle36

SP and MP budgets aren't always separate though. I remember reading an interview (on this site?) last year with one of the lead developers of Spec Ops: The Line. If you recall, the game was received as an average-esque shooter in and of itself, but praised for its narrative by all on high. Anyway, the gist of the interview was that they had to pull resources that were aimed at making the single player experience even better, in order to develop some thrown together multiplayer that no one played, and no one liked. So yes, apparently it does happen.

Now, how common is this sort of thing? Problem is, we don't really know, and sources of information are scarce and anecdotal at best, nonexistent at worst. When fans get worried, there is often a reassurance by a publisher that 'this will in no way affect the quality of the single player experience'. I'm willing to throw those statements out wholesale, not only because they're vague and unverifiable, but also because it's in the publishers direct financial interest to convince potential buyers of the superior quality of their product. Don't think a corporation would lie to you to get your money? Grow up.

So, we're left with the sometimes random outpourings of frustration from blindsided dev teams, which frankly I'm willing to meet with far less skepticism, as it's not really in their personal or financial interest to go flinging this stuff around in public (and probably to their detriment - which also means these sorts of things are less likely to enter the public realm). So, it's likely a hell of a lot more common than we think.

Gen007
Gen007 like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

I gonna have to mostly disagree with this.  I think sometimes gamers do go to far like in the case of mass effect 3 but they do have valid points more often than not. In many cases its a mix and there are valid ignorant views mixed in with the reasonable like with Bayonetta 2. If you look at the fanatics than yeah its silly they way people omplained but talk to reasonable people and you just see disappointment not in the fact that nintendo saved it but in that many if not most people who played bayonetta do not intend on getting a wii u abd thus a great series with a metric ton of potential might be lost to them. Its hard to stay interested and or excited in a game you cant play. Ill admit though some people are ignorant and blame nintendo, but in reality yes they saved it.

In the case of tomb raider though there's some valid issues there imo. You said it yourself that tacked on MP can be a desperate attempt to appeal to more gamers and it pretty much id say it is  99.9% of the time. You also argue that Resources spent on MP don't have to cut into the SP but they do. Any time and or money spent on it is time and money taken form the SP part of the game even if they have a separate team working on it. The sp will suffer for an MP mode that most hardcore and causal alike wont care about. TR is a classic and the things that made it great to all people not just gamers by the way was the strong SP elements. The story, adventuring,  puzzles ect. People who know this also know that its not the type of stuff that works well with MP anything they do MP wise is gonna be purely so that they can say on the box MP included.

The worst part of all is the assumption  that this tactic of adding MP leads to more sales which inst true. Stats probably do show that games with MP have more sales but in reality its games like COD, BF, and Halo that bring in those type of numbers for MP not TR. Id argue that it has the reverse effect because the industry has a history of doing this to games and now people are aware of it when they were at first. Making a better game period will lead to more sales period. 

Now i wont say that im gonna ignore TR completely because it has MP whe i havent even tried it yet but from what ive seen of it it and facts like that i cant say im excited for it. They are clearly trying to go the COD blockbuster route with it and i dont think its a good fit for TR imo. Its like taylor swift making a hip hop album. Not because im a self entitled gamer that dosent want anyone to enjoy TR. I actually want as many people to enjoy it as possible but i dont think many people will this way which could be bad for TR as a whole and i would hate to see TR fade away.

If it comes it and is an awesome game then great but all my exp as a gamer is just screaming average at best.

JustPlainLucas
JustPlainLucas

 I don't really know how many more times this can be said, but if a company's going to raise money strictly for the MP, they aren't going to raise that money to put into the SP.  Say for instance, a budget is drawn up for 30 million for the SP and 5 million for the MP, then it really is going to be 30 million for the SP if they decide not to make the MP.   @Setho10 several posts down goes into greater detail.  It's just this idea that some people have that every single dollar of a budget needs to be spent on the SP, so forget the MP and all those who enjoy it.  That's why I bring up the toy analogy.  It's just the thought that their games are being shared with other people (appealing to a larger audience) that makes it less desirable to them.

Gen007
Gen007

@JustPlainLucas My point is that they they are still using resources to make the MP. It dosent matter if it was raised on the side with the intention of being used for MP its time and money spent on something that people are not likely to care about. Key part being that most people don't care about these MP modes and end up skipping them altogether. Whe i say people i mean most gamers hard core and causal. I can only point to what happened with spec ops last year as an example. They aren't really appealing to "a wider audience"  but statistics that say people like games with MP which is true only if said MP is actually good. Ill admit i cant see the future and i cant say this will be a bad game when i haven't played it. I also don't suggest people skip this game because it has MP.  Maybe some people do have the selfish thing going on but most people from what Ive seen just dont want it to be a bad game which is understandable. MP for TR seems out of place which doesn't  instill confidence in the game. Overall  I think you're mistaking passion for greed.

GAME-QUEST-EX
GAME-QUEST-EX

I'm not sure the new "Tomb Raider" really needs competitive multi-player modes, but a 2-Player Co-Op feature can make sense within the context of the storyline.

Ideally, the best case scenario would be if the developers had great Single Player & Co-Op Modes in the game.

Honestly, I wouldn't lose sleep or get angry over the inclusion of any Multi-Player in "Tomb Raider." If I personally felt so strongly about disliking the addition of Multi-Player Modes in this title, I would just avoid it altogether.

But seriously, in the grand scheme of things, TR is a video game. At the end of the day, it's entertainment. There are plenty of other choices to pick from should this game suffer from the inclusion of MP.

Also, we could simply wait for the game to be released first (and to play it for ourselves), before drawing any harsh conclusions about it's overall quality.

Shika_Stoner
Shika_Stoner like.author.displayName 1 Like

Multiplayer won't cause me to not play a game. But to be fair look what happened to Mass Effect 3. They spent so much effort on the new multiplayer that probably could've been spent on making a better ending for singleplayer. lol

Dumper1
Dumper1 like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

I can't stand multi-player, too many rude idiots and just running around the same maps shooting people. Still, MP won't stop me from buying a game if the SP is good and not short.

GhansB
GhansB like.author.displayName 1 Like

"Other people want to play my game, so I no longer want to play it."

 

LOL.

that's not the reason I don't want games to have MP.

spoonybard-hahs
spoonybard-hahs like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 3 Like

Title is misleading. I thought this was going to be a discussion about the hipster tendencies of some gamers. But I'll go ahead with the argument you've presented.

 

The issue is that once again a normally single player game is having multiplayer shoved into it because developers are still struggling with how to make games more profitable beyond the yearly release cycle and to keep players from trading in their games. To be blunt, it's just lazy. Rather than devote time and resources into creating new content for after launch, the industry has realized it's more cost effective (read: cheap) to create a multiplayer component and release map packs. Granted, this doesn't mean it can't be successful. Mass Effect 3's multiplayer is fairly good. And it works because it actually has an impact on the main campaign. However, more often than not, it feels tacked on and has the bonus effect of cheapening the package as a whole. The single player campaign might be made of pure gold, but if the multiplayer is a stinker, it's going to weigh the whole thing down. There's nothing like spending $60 for a full-course meal where the steak was great but everything else was utter crap.

 

But I think you're misreading who multiplayer is aimed at. Multiplayer in games such as Tomb Raider are not made for casuals, quite the opposite in fact. Multiplayer is specifically designed to capitalize on the competitive voracity of hardcore gamers. The ones that need to be "in the fight" as often as possible. The ones who will shell out $15 for map packs. You tell a casual player that they can get four maps for $15, they'll laugh and move on to something else.

 

As for Bayonetta 2, people are understandably upset because a game they really want is being released only on a console that they have no interest in. And for a lot of them, that might actually be the only game for the Wii U they would ever care about. If they want Bayonetta 2, they also have to shell out at least $300 plus the game just to get what they want. And then it becomes an even bigger slap to the face if the game turns out to not even take any meaningful advantage of the system's hardware.

 

Is there some hyperbole from the consumer base? Undoubtedly. Is there some overreaction? Yes. However, these are legitimate complaints and concerns regarding an industry that can't seem to pull its shit together. This is not an issue of casual versus core, but rather an issue where consumer expectations are being poorly gauged by the industry.

gamingnerd121
gamingnerd121

 @spoonybard-hahs

 I'm going to have to disagree with the part about ME3 multiplayer. The MP had zero impact on the game in the grand scheme of things. The MP DLC was also free, partly because people paid for random unlock packs and backlash.

 

EA has a mandatory MP included in their games, just so they can benefit from things like online passes. Now add more microtransactions, which they already did in the sports games.

gamingnerd121
gamingnerd121 like.author.displayName 1 Like

Seems like just another apologist post for the industry. People clearly have legitimate concerns for the game.

Victorious_Fize
Victorious_Fize

lol the new tomb raider sucks not because of the multiplayer

 

but the REBOOT

JustPlainLucas
JustPlainLucas like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

@Victorious_Fize Which is funny, because people are still excited for the game, regardless of all the changes they've made to how the game plays, which throws a good number of TR staples out of the window.  Yet, it's the MP they're really upset about... 

Prats1993
Prats1993 like.author.displayName 1 Like

Developers can learn a thing or two from Dark Souls when it comes to MP or just general game design. None of these QTE's and handholding bullshit. The new Tomb Raider appears to be just another generic action title with more emphasis on cutscenes than quality or novel gameplay. Its corporate guff, do not want.

gamerboy100
gamerboy100

The reason people don't want multiplayer in Tomb Raider is because it doesn't NEED multiplayer. It just seems that they are putting it in just for the hell of it, and it takes away from single-player. Tomb Raider has always been a single-player experience, so this sounds like a gimmick tacked on at the last minute.

gamerboy100
gamerboy100

I forgot to add that it DOES take away resources from the single-player game, even if multiple teams are working on it. Both take up disc space, don't they?

nocoolnamejim
nocoolnamejim moderator moderator like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 3 Like

We've known each other a long time Lucas, so you'll pardon me for being blunt and not have any hard feelings.

 

This is the biggest load of dog sh1t I've seen since the last time I poop scooped my back yard. I mean, it's well written, but that doesn't mean it doesn't stink.

 

"We've been following Tomb Raider closely for years, and MP just now got announced for it. Do you really think that such a high profile title is going to suffer because of MP? It's entirely possible that there was a new budget drawn up solely for the MP. That happens all the time. Two different teams, one making the story mode, one making the online portion."

 

YES. Yes. Oh hell yes. Fvck to the yes. A thousand times over, YES. The list of titles that has suffered almost immediately upon implementing multiplayer is a mile and a half long. You'd have better luck counting the number of titles that WEREN'T hindered by mp additions.

 

Mass Effect 3, Uncharted 3, Bioshock 2, every Assassin's Creed game since Brotherhood, the list goes on and on. I haven't even bothered listing the high profile titles that are, at this point, basically ONLY MP with a thin veneer of a SP campaign. MP almost always means that those of us who only enjoy SP gaming are about to get dicked over by shorter, less polished campaigns.

 

People who complain about MP being forced into games that don't need it are the ones that have pattern recognition. Sure, in theory, it is possible to have a game add MP without the SP being impacted, but it's exceedingly rare. It almost ALWAYS impacts the SP.

nocoolnamejim
nocoolnamejim moderator moderator like.author.displayName 1 Like

I'd like to add that the common red herring of "another studio is doing the MP so we know it won't impact the SP" is also, to be blunt, a load of crap.

 

Money is a fungible resource. Money being spent on MP is money that is NOT being spent on SP. Basic opportunity cost economic concept.

 

Now, that could well mean that MORE money was allocated to a particular project, but that is money NOT being allocated to the SP.

 

Vader_300
Vader_300

@nocoolnamejim With all due respect, Jim, that is a load of bull&^$@. As the guy before me mentioned, budgets don't work like that; the idea that "they're taking away from one thing to add to another!" is just completely superficial. Hate to beat a dead horse here, but correlation does NOT imply causation. Not only that, but you seem to be making the assumption that pumping more money into X component of the game automatically makes X component better. Just... no. The size of the budget doesn't make the game; the DESIGNERS and their ABILITY to craft a decent and technically sound game around what resources are available make all the difference. 

Setho10
Setho10 like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

@nocoolnamejim You're wrong in one key way. Anyone who has worked on a budgeted project like a game knows that the budget is drawn up at the start of the project. The company doesn't say to a team, "Here is 30 million now make a game." The designers come up with a budget based on what they think the project needs. They then present their budget proposal to the executives who ask for changes if they feel the project is over or under budget. Then you have the budget. Having MP or not is a factor designed into the budget. The game without MP is projected to sell X copies at Y dollars per copy. Based on that, the budget of the game should be Z. Add in MP and X and possibly Y changes meaning you can increase Z. Point is, money isn't being taken away from the SP. Without the MP the budget would be lower because there would be fewer copies sold. This entire argument about money being taken away from SP to tack on MP just doesn't work usually. A budget is based on the needs of the game and the number of copies that it is expected to sell. If the company doesn't include MP then the budget won't suddenly go up for the SP. The budget for the entire game will just decrease.

JustPlainLucas
JustPlainLucas like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @nocoolnamejim "Now, that could well mean that MORE money was allocated to a particular project, but that is money NOT being allocated to the SP."

 

That right there is what I'm getting at.  So.. .pretty much fuck off to anyone who likes playing MP, huh?  How dare those gamers want multiplayer modes in MY game!  I want companies to spend all their money on ME ME ME!  That's what it boils down to.  

dem5000
dem5000

 @WTBG  

Very true...Hunters missed the mark by screwing with a tried and true formula of isolation I always loved in the Metroid Series.  But as "Angel of Darkness" proved, you can still screw up a series royally without adding multiplayer!  That one can be chalked up to selling their souls to Hollywood....

 

WTBG
WTBG

 @dem5000  @JustPlainLucas I think the core of the debate really comes down to the question "Does the addition of multiplayer take away resources and development time from the single player?"

dem5000
dem5000

 @JustPlainLucas 

 

For anyone that doesn't play MP, yeah, that's pretty much it. It has nothing to do with your sibling analogy.   I don't even know why COD bothers to have SP as I don't know one person who owns those games that ever even bothered with the campaign.  My solution is to wait for it to go down to 20 bucks then buy it for the SP. 

 

But you have a good point.  If the quality of the SP doesn't go down, then I'm fine with it if it will cost me the same regardless.  But still, I'm skeptical.  Metroid Hunters was the first in the series that I didn't enjoy, but that is only one example. 

 

I won't forgive Tomb Raider for "The Angel of Darkness" anyway....I rated it a 1.8 and never felt so ripped off in my gaming career.  I still want my 50 dollars back 10 years later!!!

Poodger
Poodger like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

I hate to be "that" guy, especially since this was very well written and I agree with you on just about every point, but...

 

"Even if that is true, can you blame them for wanting to make more money? It's a very harsh industry out there. Lots of studios have been closing their doors lately. If they get a few more bucks from tacking on MP modes, then let them do it. Just don't automatically think the single player suffered as a result."

 

This same concept applies to The Hobbit, but you were bashing on it for being a cash grab in another blog's comment section. The concept applies to everything, not just games. Just because that movie was lengthened into a trilogy for cash purposes doesn't mean the story will suffer as a result.

 

Aside from that, I fully agree with you. A very intelligent look at this issue.

Ron_W
Ron_W

Well written, and I agree with you on the first point about Tomb Raider and MP.

 

But I would have to disagree on the Beyonetta 2 issue, some people might think of it in the way you said, and that is kinda ridiculous, but most people (at least the people I have spoken to) aren't saying they don't want the game because it's on a kiddie console as you put it, they are simply annoyed that it is going to be on an console most of them aren't even going to consider buying. Sure it's a novel idea, but a lot of people, myself included, are just not interested in the tablet controller or the WiiU in general.

I had the same reaction when Dragon Quest 9 was made for DS, I'm not into handheld gaming, only handheld I owned was a GB Color which was a gift, and I borrowed a PSP from a friend to play a couple of specific games (crisis core and 3rd birthday) other than that I just don't play handheld games, so yes it pissed me off that the sequel to one of my favorite games of it's generation, and probably the the generation after it (not many games beat it for my on PS3 either) was going to be for a gaming device I will simply never consider buying for myself. I didn't say the game should never be made, and PS to handheld is a bigger leap, but since it is going exclusive to a device that is comparable in processing power, it rankles all the more.

 

Sorry, Wall of text :P

JustPlainLucas
JustPlainLucas like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @Ron_W Yeah, I get that.  But a lot of people don't have interest in not just the Wii U, but in Nintendo consoles anymore because they don't think games like Bayonetta 2 would ever come to them.  So, they stick the more "core" focused systems like the PS3 and 360.  I just find it funny that the Wii U finally gives those gamers a reason to get interested in the Wii U, and they just kinda give Nintendo the finger.  And yeah, I get that point about the tablet controller, but don't forget, they also have the traditional Pro Controller for it too.

TAMKFan
TAMKFan

People just like to nitpick on the smallest things in video games. It gets pretty ridiculous sometimes.

makryu
makryu

You mix two different things. Not wanting resources to be wasted in a MP mode which will be a slight diversion for the CoD crowd in detriment of the SP experience (and yes, there is little doubt it always is in detriment) is not elitism. It's simply players that aren't attracted to MP (we still exist, FYI) wanting, god forbid, that their wishes as consumers be considered too. Far from elitism, just common sense, really.

FlashCharge
FlashCharge

A stand alone game is becoming an ancient idea in the 21st century. Developers sell us incomplete games so we have to buy add-ons and the next installments. The old teddy bear has its place in our hearts but at sometime it only becomes a fond memory of our childhood.

Imperiusmax
Imperiusmax

You make a good point. personally I am not one for multiplayer and see no need for it in a game like Tomb raider but I wouldnt let the tacked on MP mode deter me from playing the game.

SadPSPAddict
SadPSPAddict

Well written and well thought out blog! I personally don't play much MP and am frustrated if too many trophies/achievements are on-line based!

The underlying message that gaming is about having fun is bang on though!

bamified
bamified like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

I guess we'll need to go online to earn trophies again? Another platinum trophy denied to me simply because I dislike playing online with others. Wonderful.

im-a-roustabout
im-a-roustabout like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 6 Like

If feels tacked on. gamers are allowed to express their opinions especially when sooo many other games out there have set the precedent that if it includes a MP mode, and it was once SP only, the experience will be lacking in every way including length and depth etc. In a desperate attempt to appeal to everybody content will always go south. So what's wrong with complaining about it? Personally I tire of every last developer out there feeling the need to add MP to EVERY game. God of War? Really? Dead Space? You can choose to not believe me all you want, but more than half the time with games like this, the online community is short lived, and then everybody is back to COD or Halo. The problem with this is now you are stuck with a 60 dollar game, nobody online to play with anymore, and a very short SP game. Still, I don't care how many people play the games I like. Where did you pull this information from? I don't think I have ever heard a single soul say they didn't wanna play a game b/c other people are playing it. So this article baffles me beyond comprehension.

xeis-net
xeis-net like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @im-a-roustabout go look at the early dark souls reviews on here.  There were demon souls fans fall into the elitist category who didnt want people playing their game.

StaticPenguin
StaticPenguin like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 3 Like

What bothers me about it is that they just out of the blue announced a multiplayer mode just 3 months away from release. It makes me feel like they just tacked it on last minute in order to attract a few more buyers.

Nirgali
Nirgali

 @StaticPenguin It might feel that way, but they had to have been working on it for some time and only then did they feel comfortable enough with the product to include and announce it. That's how engineering/marketing works.

GunnyHath
GunnyHath ranger like.author.displayName 1 Like

You misspelled undesirable.

Derugs
Derugs

Interesting and a nice read as well :) 

RedLegZeff
RedLegZeff like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 4 Like

I do find it kinda obnoxious when every studio feels obligated to jam multiplayer into every game, even those it has no reason to be in. Though having said that I wouldn't turn my nose up at a game just because they added multiplayer, I'd care wether the single player was good or not. Also, hardcore don't get pissed off when casuals play their games(at least I don't), we get pissed off when our games are turned into casual games. The dumbing down of the entire genre for casuals is really annoying to those who like depth. Turning all rpgs into action games, strategy series into fps(i'm looking at you syndicate) just turns really great interesting things into just another face in the crowd. It's mainly just hardcore complaining about the direction of the industry though. Oh and I don't care about tomb raider since it hasn't been relevant since the playstation. If this game is really good I'll give it a 2nd look though, multiplayer or not.

skizzel
skizzel

Uncharted... a tomb game with action shooting and ONLINE but did it sell well??????

xeis-net
xeis-net like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @skizzel i'm English, I heard the sarcasm, I would ask did it sell one extra copy because of the multiplayer?  

JustPlainLucas
JustPlainLucas

 @xeis-net  @skizzel I'm sure it did.  Did it sell enough extra copies to warrant the money put into developing the MP?  We may never know.  What I'm saying is that there are gamers who like MP, which is why we keep seeing more and more MP; there's a demand.  It could just be that they don't spend their time posting on forums to let the rest of us know they're there; they're probably playing their games.  

Dreizel
Dreizel

 @xeis-net  indeed, Uncharted would have sold well having or not MP.

MP was not the selling point for the people who bought that game.

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