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16Jan 13

With the recent bashing of DMC: Devil May Cry by fans on Metacritic, the question that comes to those who are on the fence about buying the game becomes this: who's opinion do we value the most? The critic's, or the user's? Do we take the professional opinion, or the fan's opinion?

It's a topic I'd like to discuss because I, myself have issues buying games when fan/critic reception is polarized as it is with DMC. On one hand, I really do trust critics; they will, more often than not, give a fair, honest, and balanced review of the game at hand. On the other hand, I like to look at what fans have to say about a game because it's nice to have that raw, uncensored opinion, especially with franchises that have lasted years and years.

However, in a situation where the opinion is so polarized, who do we look to for advice?

To me, the choice is and always has been critics. I know that's a bit of an unpopular opinion, so allow me to explain it:

When looking a review for anything...a book, movie, or video game, I always make sure to look at multiple sources. After all, different reviewers have different tastes and biases, so in order to get a full picture of what a game is, you need to look as many of these tastes and biases as possible. To ignore one reviewer's opinion on a JRPG because he doesn't like JRPGs is silly; his opinion is as valuable as everyone else's. In fact, I feel it's important that we frequent the reviews of such biased people.

For example, one such biased person is Yhatzee from Zero Punctuation. Yhatzee is famous for the way he berates most games that come to his screen, and therefore many people don't take his opinion seriously because, frankly, it seems that he doesn't like games. However, when Yhatzee does like a game, it means much more than it would if he praised every single game that crossed him. I am often on his page because when Yhatzee likes a game, it's doing something right (That, or he's just a banana and is getting old). After all, what does the industry learn if we praise everything thrown at us? With too much praise, nothing is left to improve, and games would become stale. That's why anti-JRPG or anti-shooter critics are important; they will nitpick at a game of a genre they dislike, and they will, at least, effectively point out a game's weaknesses even if they look over a strength. What's more, if they like a game from a genre they have an aversion to, it means so much more than if they liked a game from their favorite genre.

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcR7MjHq863g0Ay3CeOz-4s

These reviews are seriously entertaining and informative.

That all being said, I do feel that professional reviewers, in general, give a fair and balanced opinion on games most of the time. It's their job to play games, after all, and after playing so many I do not see why I should not trust their opinion. They've played hundreds of more games than I have in my lifetime; surely their perspective is inherently more informed and balanced than my own.

This trust in an informed and balanced opinion is important to my argument; professional reviewers have played a large range of games, larger than most of us have. Their decisions on what to play are determined by their work, our decisions are determined by our wallet and our interests. Reviewers don't always get a choice on what to play; they just play what they're given and review it. We get to choose, and because of that our range of games played will be naturally smaller than those played by the reviewers.

For example, I'm an avid JRPG player. With this information, which game would I be more likely to buy: Ni No Kuni: Wrath of the White Witch or Hitman: Absolution?

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSMdM1gmC9KR_8N4zJSKge

The answer is clear. I want this game. Now.

Now, let's say that, after a long period of time this year, I buy 4 JRPGs 3 Adventure games and 1 FPS game. Which genre would you trust my opinion on the most? The one I have the most experience playing, of course. If my only exposure to the FPS genre was, say, Medal of Honor: Warfighter, I might think it's a fantastic game. After all, with nothing else to compare it to, why wouldn't I? The game is extremely average, so I wouldn't find anything inherently wrong with it if I hadn't played games such as Half-Life 2 or Bioshock in the past.

This expectation of experience is where I find weakness in the reviews of fans: I will never know what games they've played before, hell I won't even know if they've even played the game they're reviewing. I could go give a review of Ni No Kuni right now, provided I do enough research, and bash the game without even having had played it before. Nobody would know I didn't play it, a fact that makes the entire review invalid. On the flip side, we have to expect that professional critics have played the game before because...well, it's their job. If you don't do your job, you get fired. Clearly a reviewer has done their job if a review is posted.

Of course, this is not to say that fans can't give as good of an opinion that a critic does. Sometimes fan reviews can even be better than professional ones; it's just hard to find those reviews and, honestly, there aren't that many. In a community where fanboyism and trolling run rampant, I take more comfort in a review by someone who I can expect to be above such things.

69 comments
TheLamaKnows
TheLamaKnows

I agree totally on sourcing. I prefer a reviewers score over the herd because a review is supposed to be unbiased (despite all the accusation of payoffs tossed about here) and the people that argue over the reviews are clearly biased towards or against certain titles. I also only glance at the number score- the content of the review is what is important. 

I will disagree about Zero Punctuation. He's entertaining sure- but his review methodology is useless. He has no real review process and therefore anything he likes or dislikes is based on no more informed an opinion than any random gamer you ask. 

The difference between a critic and fan with a youtube acct is a real, thought out, inclusive review unbiased from the start. Critic implies some level of professionalism in the endeavor. Simply having a platform to spew opinion is a far cry from being a critic in any meaningful sense.

maitkarro
maitkarro

Easy, I decide what I buy, reviews are just other peoples opinions in their own perspective. Though I use reviews to get info about a new genre to see what's this about. Negative info I mostly disregard, unless it's something that I already dislike, then I'm cautious about it (like totally don't wanna play any Resident Evil or Silent Hill or Manhunt, good games but not for me).

JulyAeon
JulyAeon

Brilliant post, Thunderstarter.  It sums up the reviews system, only to be reminded that many reviews from us are often not much more than opinions. 

I have to admit I like to research the internet on as many different reviews as possible on a game I might be interested in, only to find myself being influenced by buyer reviews and YouTube Gameplays (quick look, as I don't want to spoil my gameplay!).  And most likely I will buy and enjoy a game that got average and sometimes dismal reviews.  

That games have to appeal to the masses instead of the GENRE player it was supposed to appeal to creates the confusion of who I might want to listen to.  Genre is there for a purpose: more variety in game play preferences, more choices, more freedom.  All of it seems to be in decline as games are targeted for the masses.  Expert reviews and opinions are becoming meaningless as no one can be an expert on everything, it now belongs to mechanics, graphics and while these are important to the games we play, it does not make me spend money on such a hyped franchise.  I rather go for flawed game with the specific genre I like as to a over-hyped picture perfect graphic achievement awarded franchise. 

So I really need to know what I want from my games these days and do the above mentioned research on the internet. Covers and Trailers don't do it for me at all anymore (probably never did anyway).  Too much money is spend on moronic marketing practices that would be better spend on making a proper genre game as to the mishmash I come across these days. 

Unless the GENRE will be put back into the games reviews and opinions will always wildly clash and not be able to give a clear picture of expertise.  There will be no question of who I will listen to and who I will believe in ( and that will be my instinct). I know what I want (genre) and I know what I don't want (mishmash).

 

RedLegZeff
RedLegZeff

Uh, fans are usually morons. Half the time they give reviews and opinions on stuff they haven't played read or watched. All the outrage on zelda/resident evil 6 getting bad reviews were about the same day the game came out, and half never played it. Half the people complaing about devil may cry say they're so upset about the lousy game that they won't rent or buy it...meaning they haven't played it. Critics are at least likely to have played the game before they make an opinion on it. Well, I think fan opinion is mainly bad in sequals. If it's a non sequel you probably get better less biased opinions. Though fans also get turned off by trivial stuff. I've heard a number of complaints about borderlands cell shading a few years ago. Not really a reason to not give a game a chance.

Victorious_Fize
Victorious_Fize

I like seeing what the fanbase has to say, and if they're telling me to run away like a MOFO, I sure will.


Because reading 4 to 12 walls of texts from all sorts of site about a frigging video game just to know whether I should shell out $40-$60 on it is atrocious. Not that I'm a richass, but it's just that I'm not this much of a jackass either.


Just listen to the fanbase, watch some gameplays on YouTube, and generally take your time till I feel it's all good and post on forums or somewhere to clear your head. That's how it should be done.

People who read reviews, especially from a site like GameSpot (Gerstmann, anyone?), should especially feel bad about themselves and how they stand as gamers.

jeffrobin
jeffrobin

I usually look at the top 1/2 dozen scores in meta critic and the bottom 1/2 dozen scores. For me it's the quickest way to get to the truth. I will also do the same for user reviews as I reckon anyone who has gone to the bother of writing a review has something useful to say as they are doing it for free and tend to be the more articulate and intelligent gamers.  I have been burnt by reviews though so just like movies stick with people who have similar tastes and are blunt in their honesty.

Apart from that I agree with you, users tend to be more nit picky and honest than professional reviewers so it's good to get their opinion as well as the pro's. One thing I do try to ignore is all the posted comments they tend to be filled with people who have an agenda.

rtircoklled
rtircoklled

I really liked this. Sometimes I forget why I should listen to people who are haters, (either of a series, genre or specific game) but really their opinions do have some important insights.  Also, even though I agree that critics give bree better reviews most of the time, if not all the time, but it really helps to know the critic a little bit sometimes because I've seen critics that would obviously not like a game rate it anyway

Master_Vexov
Master_Vexov

Trust a review that isn't biased, there is always things wrong with a game(far more these days).

Sorting out facts from opinions is the trouble, I personaly just don't trust anything now... everything seems to just be thrown for 10yr olds to go hyper active on. Colors, noises, big numbers, slaughter everything like some kind of God.

Simply, there is no room for trust, read reviews to get "opinions" and wait for real gameplay videos. I've seen too many games get +2-4 more marks them it should have gotten (x/10).

danielwd
danielwd

@Master_Vexov Indeed games these days do have more wrong with them, this is actually because there is more in them. Games are far more complex now (mostly) than they used to be. All Nintendo had to focus on was getting Mario to jump in exactly the right way. But games like far cry 3 have got so many things going on that there is more to go wrong.

AnXboxGuy
AnXboxGuy

I listen to critics' every time as they critique the games better before a purchase.

That's drawing from my personal experience. Quite a few gamers have told me to try out [insert game here] only to have me taking it back the next day. This is usually from their poor journalism and lack of veracity and authenticity with their review. I won't give fans (or rather the masses) the time of day to inform me as to what I should get.

So basically: listen to many critics' (GameSpot, IGN, etc.) and steer clear of the masses.

danielwd
danielwd

@AnXboxGuy Don't look at ign, they can't be trusted as far as they can be thrown.

DAnTeKira
DAnTeKira

you got it all wrong. Todays gaming journalism is falling apart with more and more cases of companies pressing and buying gaming journalists to give good reviews and hype the games up. While users reviews may be more personal, they are fair and have no intention of tricking you. Putting together a lot of user reviews will in the end make a more balance and realistic assessment of a game quality then listening to press reviews that might as well have been corrupted like the DmC ones. If you compare does reviews you will see the users reviews go more in depth than the reviewers that fail to mention a lot of problems with the game and always fail to compare it to previous titles when this is essential to determine the final value of the game. In the end the press just talked about the good things, hyped it up, lied about how good the story is (when its terrible) and left out all the downgraded aspects that makes it inferior to previous entries. I read and seen user reviews online and they make a more solid, professional review than the press ever did

PlaWeird
PlaWeird like.author.displayName 1 Like

To be honest, I don't trust people's opinions, as they are not mine. When thinking of a new game to buy, the first thing I'll do is to look for a demo - that way I can test the game myself and ponder if it's worth a buy. If a demo's not available, I watch gameplay videos (preferably muted if there's commentary) and try to get an idea of the game.

Usually if there's a series I like, I can buy the game without knowing anything about it; in fact, this is what I'd prefer to do the most. You get so much more FEELS for the game when you play it for the very first time, with absolutely no knowlegde of it beforehands.

MooncalfReviews
MooncalfReviews

User =/= fan.

If the game is a sequel then it already has established fans. These people cannot be trusted. They are rabid.

However, the general players / users of the game who come with no pre-conceived fanboy notions can be trusted, in my opinion, just as much as the critics, and sometimes even moreso (depending on what you're looking for, and what types of critics they are). Generally I listen to players on matters such as bugs, gameplay, graphics ... all of that stuff you don't need to be intelligent to appreciate. But I listen to the critics more when it comes to stories and art.

tannertehpianis
tannertehpianis

A very well written blog. I'd like to go back to your point that reviewers don't get to choose a lot of the games they play, while users pick games based on our wallets and interests. I feel that a user would be much less inclined to view an 'average' (6 or 7) game favorably if he had to shell out 50 or 60 bucks to buy it, especially considering that there are so many AAA titles out there. A reviewer, however, views the games he or she plays a bit more fairly, as the reviewer isn't constricted by his budget. In this case, I feel that a reviewer's score would be a fairer one than a user's.

huerito323
huerito323

I always thought DMC had awesome combat. Besides that, I thought the story and characters sucked. The only great DMC games were 1 and 3. Never cared for Dante.


This new DMC is amazing to me. The story is actually good, the characters are cool, Dante being the best one. Best DMC game so far for me.

DeltaMike90
DeltaMike90

If you're not a fan, obviously you should trust the critics. If you are fan... it's more difficult. Probably best to read what other fans say about the game and consider how it will fit your preferences.

purple_monkey33
purple_monkey33

In this case I?d say definitely go with the critics because unlike the morons on Metacritic they?ve actually played the game.Frankly I think this is a case of some people just instantly deciding they were going to hate the game the second they saw Dante?s redesign

My own two cents on the game is I?ve been a fan of Devil May Cry since the original and although I?ve only tried the demo for DMC I thought it seemed pretty fun.

swyg
swyg

The only review that you can trust is yours.  Opinions also change over time.  Just because you agreed with critic or fan reviews of a game when that game came out doesn't mean you will agree with it later on.

bannermanner
bannermanner

Metacritic user scores are often backed up by incoherent rants comprised of butchered language.  Would argue that most of these user reviewers have not played the games they "review," and even less of them to completion.

VampireLord123
VampireLord123

I would not believe the user base reviews are the one to trust. It is easy to post a review or just give a score to a game without even having it. Therefore, it is not viable to trust the user base, because it does not guarantee the reviewer objectivity. In the case of DMC it was obvious from the beginning that fan base reliability was already compromised, they hate it the game for no reason at all. The game was not even out yet, they were complaining about things that did not make sense. One questions I have for the fan base is this, how many of them actually played the game in the insane difficulty levels of Devil May Cry, I am sure there is people that finish the other games in the hardest difficulty, but I think it would be a minimal.

Prats1993
Prats1993

Totally agree, Ive learned to never trust the Metacritic user scores with only a few exceptions (cough, Diablo 3, cough, cough). The user score for DMC is bullshit having just played it and being a big Hack n slash fan myself, the game is solid.

gba1989
gba1989

I agree with what you say in your last paragraph. But still a game is needed to be played to see whether you'll really like it or not. It's a bit of a risk and decision on the gamer's part. Firsthand experience is better than wholly trusting on reviews. Reviews do have their merits though.

Arbalon
Arbalon like.author.displayName 1 Like

Looking at both is the best way to go about things... Getting both the professional opinion, and the un-edited opinions help.. its nice to see both ends of the spectrum, get an idea of why the game may be poor, and also get an idea of how good the game is at the same time. 

Sheik2
Sheik2 like.author.displayName 1 Like

Keep in mind that among the "fans", there are many trolls. Some of those trolls have numerous accounts to give similar scores/reviews again and again, to make their troll big. If you want an honest, non-troll fanbase, you can look in the player reviews / scores in gamespot or IGN, because metacritic is really FULL of trolls.

NTM23
NTM23

There are people that will say "Well they've played more games than me." That doesn't make them right. For instance, if you were new to games, and had just played a new Call of Duty and absolutely loved it, would it be wrong to love it even though it rehashes the same tricks over and over? In time, if Call of Duty or any other franchise keeps putting out the similar game we've seen before, the scores will go down and criticism will rise, but it doesn't make the game bad to everyone. So I don't understand that sentiment because it doesn't always apply. 

I guess you could say it's because since they've played so many games, they should know what games are good and bad, but that's still not true because difference in opinions get in the way of that, so you can't always rely on it. Anyways, I'm not entirely sure why you brought up how critics that love other genres that play games in an undesired genre to them, that seems a bit like a tangent from the topic. 

I think if you can find a well-written review that's at least as informative as a professionals, then you should read it if you want to, but also take into account the other side if you're going to do that. More often than not though, bias gets in the way of fans and users in general, so most of the time when a game's scored that low when compared to critics, the fans are wrong when talking about the majority.

To be frank though, if it comes down to this, if you really had to think about this, I wouldn't listen to either, and just play the game and then decide; sometimes both are wrong, and sometimes both are right. Just get DMC and decide for yourself.

Thunderstarter
Thunderstarter

@NTM23 I think some people missed the point of this blog. I used the DMC issue to launch a discussion, I actually have little interest in the playing the game. 

NTM23
NTM23

@Thunderstarter I didn't necessarily miss the point, but I did have one mistake, I kind of skimmed through some of it and didn't really think of the blog as much as believe I got the jist of what you were talking about; rarely happens, but this was an exception unfortunately, sorry.

NTM23
NTM23

@Thunderstarter I should also state that I actually had another thing going that I had erased, though was much more in line with what you're trying to discuss. Oh well.

xsonicchaos
xsonicchaos

I did not read all of this, but I know what your point is. Critics are humans too and too many of them are not even "professionals", but mere casual gamers that live in their past childhood, where games used to give mysteries and unknown for the small price of your time... and some cash. If you closely analyze the critic's score you'll see a range from 0 to 10 that also varies from good writing to bad. So, gamers, fans or not, have their opinion that matter. For them. What actually doesn't matter is the score, either score. For anyone. If you don't have the game, play the demo. It gives enough insight on the game to make up your mind if you're going to buy it or not. If you have the game, what really counts is your opinion, your personal score, say it (or write it) out loud if you want to and let people make up their own minds. Don't let yourself get fooled by numbers.

Lucky_Krystal
Lucky_Krystal

I like to listen to both. And also make my own judgements based on story summaries, trailers, and gameplay videos. Because sometimes listening to only critics or only fans doesn't help. The very niche games I like either get underrated (in my opinion of course) or they get panned by critics, yet I enjoy them anyway. Had I only listened to critic scores, I would have never picked those games up.

Yet there are times when its better to just listen to a number of critics instead of fans, like in the DMC case. Sure there are some fans that gave detailed and sensible reasons why they don't like the game. But most of the fan reviews I'm seeing consist of "LOL NOT REAL DMC SHIT SUXS EMO EMO EMO 0/10!!" These were reviews posted the day the game came out, so I question if these people even played through the whole game.

I think its a matter of making your best judgement with the information given. ALL the info including sensible fan reviews, critics reviews, demos, trailers, gameplay videos, etc. In the end, your opinion is the opinion that matters the most.

ash162
ash162 like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

More importantly one should read reviews thoroughly rather than just jumping on the score. The score system gives a very narrow view of the game and the quality of its content. In a written review each aspect of the game is touched upon and the gamer can decide basing on the type he likes the most i.e. story, gameplay, graphics..............

Articuno76
Articuno76 like.author.displayName 1 Like

One difference between fan opinion and those of professional critics is that fans (and by fan opinion here I mean the deep, reflective and well-written kind) have more time to go into the depths of the game mechanics and see the upper ceiling of the games skill level.  Professional reviewers don't have the same time afforded to them because they have to review several games at once (in addition to other duties like previewing games and interviews and such).  As a result it is unavoidably the case that many professional reviewers don't get the chance to finish the games they review let alone explore the post-game content or plunge the depths of the game system.

Such a gap between fans and professional critics can be seen when looking at genres like fighting games where almost every single major fighting game release will score somewhere in the 8s, but the community who really analyses the game will place the same games anywhere on a scale of 4-10.

In the case of DmC I hear that the skill ceiling is much lower than the previous games, something only people who have put in a lot of time or who are very good would know.  I haven't played it myself but I have seen some videos of pro players not being happy with the end result.


BlueTurtz
BlueTurtz like.author.displayName 1 Like

I played the demo and honestly I felt that the simple combat was just too boring, I like complicated mechanics in games that are rewarding, not auto aim pistols...

CRAPCOM1926
CRAPCOM1926

@BlueTurtz U must not like dragon quest games them sir. Or perhaphs u like combat system like the Tales of series. Jrpg normally are Turn based with simple yet entertaining combat, new mechanich appear the more u play the game, beside almots every JRPG star really weak at first and just  get better and better.

CRAPCOM1926
CRAPCOM1926

@BlueTurtz Will us have to wait and see how the game develops, also the game seems to use low scales, what i mean is i dont think will ever see atacks that does 9999 damages or more i thing the hightes damage will be 999. Thats not bad. Ok Blue i recomend u to Play DRAGON QUEST 8 for the PS2 if u dont like that game, u probably wont like these one either.


BlueTurtz
BlueTurtz

@CRAPCOM1926 @BlueTurtz I Don't play JRPG's and considering this is more of a western game it should have appealed more to the western audience but for me, it didn't.

Kyrylo
Kyrylo

Everybody are forgetting that critics are just humans, like users. They are highly subjective like all of us (if somebody isn't paid for score) So in the end the only real decision is to add 2 polar scores divide by 2 and see what in the middle. 

IanNottinghamX
IanNottinghamX

@Kyrylo Critics shouldnt be overly subjective they should be way more objective..Objectivity I feel has been lost in the recent generations of gaming. During the Snes Era(what I grew up on) you could trust the scores in gaming magazines and media because they scaled the scores to what else is out on the system at that time. So you could get an accurate read of how good the game is. Now a days its like the reviewers just want to make a name for themselves as a critic and will trash on a game weather its good or not just for the sake of getting a few extra views to a site because of the controversy.  All I would ask from reviewers is fair reviewing of a game if sensationalist reviews are what your going for thats a  short sighted goal. People eventually see through that stuff...especially when their hard earned dollar is involved in their purchasing choices with games and find out your source is not a reliable one to count on..

Kyrylo
Kyrylo

@IanNottinghamX @Kyrylo IT's getting harder and harder. Back in NES times you had games that all shared their pixels amount and basic structure. Nowadays there are just to many diverse points like engine, realistic vs. escapism, west vs. east, big studio vs. small, etc,etc. So subjective opinion is almost impossible at that point, because if every reviewer posted true opinion it would be chaos over every single game. 

DiamondDM13
DiamondDM13

@Thunderstarter @DiamondDM13 @Kyrylo @IanNottinghamX Well, they don't get high scores, but they do get higher scores in general compared with eastern ones.

As for that theory, I don't know where you heard that. This is just something I've been noticing, but it has now become more evident, specially because it is now being evident on games and franchises I do love...

Kyrylo
Kyrylo

@IanNottinghamX @Kyrylo Marketing became hard business. To survive companies want more and more money, consumers demands more and more from companies and really? I think it need to be stopped. The time where consumers, publicity and reviewers were part of same community long gone, and I hope it gonna change for the better and not for the worst. 

IanNottinghamX
IanNottinghamX

@Kyrylo Ive played many types of games....Todays games are more homogenous than games from the 8 bit and 16bit era imo because for the most part they are trying to make mini movies with most games...but what it all boils down to is games are games. Even if there are more diverse types of games, games are still games so the scale should still fall within the reason of my point. If I can rate a game and compare it to similar games of a certain quality then you can guesstimate weather you can trust my rating of that game.The fact of the matter is game ratings are more about sensationalism,bias and kickbacks than about the game now a days. 

Thunderstarter
Thunderstarter

@Kyrylo @Thunderstarter @DiamondDM13 @IanNottinghamX  I have no comment on MGR/DMC because I'm not paying particular attention to those games, but you're wrong about Skyrim. Most if not all reviewers mentioned how buggy it was. They just deemed that the strengths overcome its flaws in the long run. 

Kyrylo
Kyrylo

@Thunderstarter @DiamondDM13 @Kyrylo @IanNottinghamX you can't deny that west games oft forgiven for the same things east get trashed. Just remember MGR and DmC demos. Both had equally bad bugs. But GS only posted critique on MGR without mentioning DmC. Skyrim was buggy as hell, yet nobody even said it in their reviews.

Thunderstarter
Thunderstarter like.author.displayName 1 Like

@DiamondDM13 @Kyrylo @IanNottinghamX If your claim is true, every game developed in the west should get a high score, but this is not true. On top of this, every game developed in the east would get a bad score, also not true. 
Sorry, but the whole East vs. West conspiracy theory doesn't fly with me. 

DiamondDM13
DiamondDM13

@Kyrylo @IanNottinghamX Well, RE6 being developed in Jap got a 4.5, while DMC, because it was developed by NT, western, got an 8. This is why I'm starting to lose my trust in Gamespot reviews. Both games don't feel like games from their franchises, yet one of them gets twice the score for being developed in the west... Way to go GS...

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